Love & Respect

In marriage, each spouse has a core need. Ephesians 5 tells us that women need love and men need respect. Put in plain terms, women need to be prioritized and men need to be admired. If a husband shows his wife she's his #1 priority, she will feel loved. If a wife admires her husband, he will feel loved. 

Today's episode dives into one of our favorite books on marriage - Love & Respect by Dr. Emmerson Eggerichs. We will discuss these two core needs in marriage and the three cycles couples can find themselves in as they meet or "don't meet" these needs. 

Enjoy. 

Transcript

So today we're talking about love and respect specifically, um, a fantastic book, I would say is in the top five books you need to read on marriage called love and respect by Dr. Emerson Egeritz. And we got a chance to spend some time with Emerson and his wife, Sarah. They are the real deal. And, um, we know that Sarah is the brains of the outfit, of course, but we wanted to look deep.

Into love and respect. Talk about what love is, talk about what respect is, why a man needs respect, a woman needs love, and then three cycles. I'm not going to explain those cycles yet, but the three cycles that they give, and it's just so powerful that this book is, is one of those books that's got a very, um, simple, but deep meaning.

Yeah. And it's very easy to understand and comprehend and it gives us just a simple handle to hold on to. Yeah. It's so good. And, uh, you know, as we meet with couples, I don't think there's been a time that we've met that this doesn't come up in conversation. Um, it just, everybody can relate to it. It has helped us so much in our own relationship and you know, just in the past couple months, I can't tell you how many times this, this topic has come up in conversation with different couples and it is.

Um, it's just amazing how relevant it is to all of us in our marriages. Yeah, I love it. Well, before we jump into that, I've got a great song for you. Now, you all know I was raised in Texas, Dallas, Texas. So I grew up listening to 80s and 90s music, obviously, but what was big in Texas is 80s and 90s country.

So George Strait, I mean, Shenandoah, Diamond Rio, Brooks and Dunn, Blackhawk. Obviously, Garth Brooks, um, with Tim McGraw and all of them, but there was one guy named Travis Tritt, and he sang two love songs that were just so strong. One was called Anymore by Travis Tritt, T R I T T is his name, but this other song that was my favorite of his is called Drift Off to Dream, and it's about this guy who's sitting in a bar.

And he, he's lonely, he doesn't have any prospects or anything like that. And he's talking to this person and they start asking him what he wants. And he talks about what he would want in a wife. And then he sings this song about what he could see one day. And so I love this because what he's singing about, we all want to do.

And anyway, Travis Tritt, he is, he's awesome. I mean, old school country. So you might think, man, that sounds a little slow, but this is, this is good music. If you don't like this, find another podcast to listen to. All right. So I'm gonna play this for about 40 seconds. You guys are going to love it.

That's so good. It is good.

Wait for it.

I love it. It's so good. Isn't that hilarious? We listened to that a lot when we were dating. We did. We had a lot of really good 90s country music that we listened to when we dated. Um, what I think is hilarious about these songs, Is versus like what he just said, we can dance to the radio right up till dawn.

And then you'll drift off, drift off to dream in my arms. It's like, who wants to dance literally all night long? Yeah. Let's, let's take it back a notch. Let's take, let's do one dance song and move on to the next thing. Yeah. And then, uh, gosh, I think probably the most classic. Crazy line in any love song is Faith Hill, Tim McGraw singing.

Let's make love all night long until all my strength is gone. It's like, who wants to do that all night long? Really all night long. Come on. No, come on. Get the job done and sleep overwhelming. Everyone would be a hilarious line. Let's make love. Get it done as quick as possible so we can watch a movie tonight.

Anyway, man, I seriously digress, but okay, let's talk love and respect. All right. Now this is all based on the one scripture found in Ephesians five verse 33, where Paul is talking and he says this, he says, however, and he's talking to men specifically here, each one of you men must love his wife as he loves himself.

And then the wife must respect her husband. And so we see this command very clear. And this is where Dr. Emerson gets his whole premise for the book, love and respect men. Need respect women need love. So women need love men need respect now What Tori and I have done is we'll dive a little bit deeper and I've To basically explain to you through our book what we mean by love what we mean by respect So when women need love what love is is prioritization like she needs to feel the priority when we say men need respect what we what that means is men need admiration, so If your wife is going to feel loved, she needs to, she needs to feel prioritized.

Right. And if your husband is going to feel respected, he needs to feel admired. You thank him for what he does, praise him for who he is. The prioritization, obviously a man needs to feel prioritized as well. And a woman needs to feel respected as well. But what Dr. Emerson pulled out, and it does make sense is the primal need that God.

Put inside of each of you is that the woman like Tori, she needs to feel my 100 percent priority, which is love to her. And I need to feel her 100 percent respect, which is admiration to me. If she admires me, thanks me for what I do, praise, praises me for who I am, man, I feel loved. And if I prioritize her, I don't put my work or my job or my buddies in front of her.

Then, wow, she feels loved, right? And when they feel like this, when each spouse feels like this, great things can happen. Yeah, and I, I loved reading, I just brushed up on, on this book, Love and Respect, again. I think it's one of those that could be read yearly, honestly, as a refresher. But, um, And, you know, he talked, he, he's a marriage counselor, he's a pastor and he did marriage counseling I think for like 30 years or something.

And he said that this, this thing just kept on coming up in his own relationship with his wife, Sarah. And then in, in his counseling with these men and women, he said, it just over and over and over came up that the woman didn't feel. Loved and the man didn't feel respected right and he said and it's in he read that scripture over and over and over again And then it was just hit him like oh my goodness.

This is such a secret weapon here He just digs in and explains exactly what happens when when we don't Choose to love and to respect it turns into what he calls Yeah, those are three cycles. Are we talking cycles right now? Or do you want to go into that? Or do we want to talk love and respect a little bit more?

Sure, whatever you want to do. Okay, well, let's do love and respect. Okay, so when it comes to love. The woman needs to feel prioritized. You cannot have intimacy and divided loyalty. Okay. And this is what Tori felt for the first five years of our marriage. As I was off with my brother building a business, and this happens to a lot of guys.

We get married and then we're like, man, we've just got this overwhelming feeling of, I need to provide, you know, I need to provide and protect. You know, my spouse, but then priority kind of falls off because we're focusing on provision and protection, right? And so we're building our business or we're working at our job, trying to build wealth for our family.

And these are all really good things, but we cannot let our relationship with our spouse fall into second place. And a man is willing, or so, excuse me, a man prioritizes his wife when he's willing to sacrifice for her. So if you are in a position to where you have to work a whole lot, right, which is where I was in my first five years.

You know, I didn't get it right in my, in my, uh, actually first, you know, 15 years of marriage, but in my first five years, I didn't get it right. Um, but if I could go back and talk to myself in those first five years, I would tell myself, Hey, keep working hard. Like don't stop doing that. Like it's, it's going to pay off.

Keep working hard, but listen, reprioritize your non work activities. Like if golf is something that you absolutely love to do, um, and that takes up four hour clip out of your day and you've got young kids at home and you have to work 50, 60 hours a week. Then stop golfing right like right like stop doing that like don't there will come a time where you can do that again Yeah, right So you reprioritize yourself if you know hanging out with the guys doing your fantasy football and stuff is important to you You do, right, but it's taken away time and you've got, you know, these, these, this massive priority at the office where you've got to be there a lot, then just make sure that your fantasy football isn't, isn't happening in personal parties with your buddies, but you can do these things over zoom.

So like, just figure out a way to make it work and reprioritize. Your non work priorities, you know, your non work things so that you can keep working hard like you're doing, but then your spouse doesn't feel like she's second fiddle because you've got these other hobbies and these other needs that you have that's outside of work that represents provision and protection.

That's love. Did you want to say something about that? No, keep going. Okay, so in Ezekiel 16, um, and I just, I think it's just so fantastic. Actually, I said Ezekiel 16. I'm talking about Ruth. Um, when Ruth, if you read from the book of Ruth, how Boaz, her husband, he was, he provided for her, he protected her, and the whole way that this came around, then he made her feel a priority.

And here's the beauty. Then she arose a queen. Now Ruth wasn't crowned queen, but she had royalty coming from her blood, right? Ruth, because of the way Boaz provided for her, protected her, but then made her feel a priority. I think that's where men often miss it. They're like, man, I'm great provider, great protector.

And your wife feels that, but then she doesn't feel prioritized. And that's a huge problem. So that's love. Then respect. Respect is about admiration. Psalm 100 verse four. Says, um, enter my gates with Thanksgiving, my courts with praise. If you've listened to our podcast, read our books or done anything with us, then you know, that we talk about this a lot.

Admiration is shown through thanks and praise. So if you want to enter into God's presence. Then you thank him for what he's done, praise him for who he is, wives, you want to enter into your husband's presence. You want your husband's full presence with you. Thank him for what he does, praise him for who he is, even if he's not acting quite like you want him to still give him that thanks and praise and that admiration, he'll receive it as respect and watch how his behavior begins to change.

Yeah. And I love this. When you look at the difference between love and respect. It's the difference between a Hallmark store and a military commercial. A Hallmark store, you go into the Hallmark store and who knows how long those are going to last, you know? Right. Because of digital, you know, the internet and all that kind of stuff.

But a Hallmark store, you go in there, it's all about love. Right? But a military commercial, it's all about respect. Yeah. The Hallmark store, it's demographic is women. Yeah. Middle aged women. The military commercial it's for young men and they know that young men need it. And so it's all about honor and respect.

And both of those brands Hallmark for women and the military for men, they understand their demographics so well that let's just look at that as married couples, men act more like a Hallmark card, women. Give them a little military stuff, you know, give them a little, Hey, you're great at what you do, right?

Thank you for what you do. Exactly. And you know, Emerson talks about how without love she Responds without respect like this is kind of the nature of the game, right? That they're without love She she reacts without respect without respect. He reacts without love And so the cycle begins and we see this all the time, but you're right, like if you, if we can just get into the mind of a man, if we could just get into the mind and men get into the mind of a woman, what is it that is going to, is going to make her feel loved 

 The, the essential element of love is sacrifice. So if a guy wants his wife to feel prioritized, then what he has to do is he has to sacrifice some things, right? That's how she feels loved. That's why the command is a man is to love his wife as Christ loved the church.

What did he do to show his love for the church? He sacrificed, so he sacrificed his own life. What we as men have to do is we have to sacrifice things that we want to do, that we can do, that she'd probably be okay with us doing so that we can spend more time with her so we can spend more time with the kids so we can spend more time at home, whatever that looks like.

And if we sacrifice like that, she receives it as love. Uh, just. Tiny little example. There have been times, Tori knows how much I love working out. There have been times where, um, Well, her and I are planning on a workout and we, we come right up and we're getting ready to go and she's like, Oh shoot, I got to do this thing for Lundy or whatever.

Or I forgot I've got to do this, you know, I got to bake this thing for Thanksgiving or whatever. There are times where she's totally fine with me running out and I'll just go hit a workout or whatever. And that's fine. And she's good with that. And she's totally cool with that. But you know what? If there, if the other times I, I'm like, you know what?

If you're not working out, I'm not going to work out. Then even though she's totally fine with me going off and working out. If I do that. She receives that as priority love because it makes her feel prioritized. It's something small. Let me help you. Let me jump in and help you with what you want. You need to do.

And then we could do something like go for a walk or do something together. And, and I'm, I mean, of course, like he said, it's not like every time, but you sprinkle that in to, to a week that happens once a week. I, I, my love tank is full. I'm like, Hey, wow. Thanks. That meant a lot that you chose to jump in with me and to try to find something we could do together.

Yeah. So I would say to the men out there, I would say, um, find something that you really like doing that does not involve your wife or your kids and give it up on occasion so that you can be with your wife and kids. That will show priority. Yeah. Okay. And then in the first chapter, he jumps into this thing called assume goodwill.

And I think it is so, so important. Um, and he just talks about how, okay, so yes, we need love and respect. But we need to also assume goodwill in our spouse. Now there are going to be times where Jason's like, you know, it's busy and our lives are crazy and there's, you know, he, he's trying to get a workout in and, um, he's not going to choose to stay with me.

I'm like, Hey, you want to stay with me? We'll do this. He's like, Oh, it's not going to work. Cause this, this and this. Right. I assume goodwill because I know that Jason does love me. And it's not based on all of these, you know, these things being right and in line. But I know on a whole, he loves me. He has showed me he loves me.

He's, he, I, I see the effort that he's putting in and I'm going to assume. Goodwill and it is so easy not to do this right because we all have history with our spouse We're like well, they don't always I don't know like it doesn't always seem like yeah things are going You know the way that we we talk about or the way that we're really trying and it's easy to be like Oh, you're just being selfish or but It is so important to, to kind of switch the, switch the narrative and be like, you know what, he's a good guy, he's trying, you know, and I think Um, you know, he gives, Emerson gives an example and it's just really funny.

I was laughing. Um, he, he was talking about how his wife Sarah loves to cook and she always makes eggs and she loves a ton of pepper on her eggs. I appreciate that Sarah. I know I was going to say that you're Sarah in our relationship, Jason loves some pepper. Yes. And. Um, Emerson does not like pepper. So he said for like 20 years, he's told her, please don't put pepper on my eggs.

And she's always in a hurry and just, you know, doing her thing. And she just puts pepper on his eggs every time it comes with this huge layer of pepper. And he said. As baffled as I am by the constant peppering, he's like, I don't get it. I've told you, don't put pepper on my eggs for 20 years. It's easy, but you're still putting pepper that he's like, but I know Sarah.

She is in a hurry. She's trying to do a thousand things at once. And she's not remembering that I don't like pepper, even though it's been 20 years of telling her I don't want pepper in my egg. I know Sarah. She's not doing it out of ill intent. She's just in the groove moving fast and not thinking about it.

And so I assume goodwill, you know, that even though it could be like, are you kidding me? Like how many, like, I feel like that with you and I, I'm like, how many times have I told you I don't like this? Yeah. Yeah, but It's so important, like, we live, like, life is crazy. Life is busy. We're not gonna get it right all the time.

Yeah. I'm gonna make a ton of mistakes. You're gonna make a ton of mistakes. But we love each other. And we're gonna, and it's, it's so important that we make that decision that we're gonna assume goodwill. We're gonna see the good. Yeah. And we're going to assume that we're both trying, we're both doing our best.

And even though we mess up a gazillion times. Yeah. And you know, um, I heard this thing from Craig Groeschel's book, Winning the War in Your Mind, which is fantastic. And we've talked about that before on this podcast, but, um, He talks about cognitive bias that you've got to be very careful with the cognitive biases that you have, which are basically the biases that you think about, right?

That everybody has a cognitive bias. And what Tori and I are saying is make your cognitive bias, assuming goodwill for your spouse. Like you are biased toward, no, she didn't really mean it like that. No, he didn't really mean it like that. Right? And so. And he gave this great example that if I'm about to walk into a, a big get together, a big gathering where there's a lot of people, and then right before I walk in, my friend who I'm going to this party with says, Hey, by the way, everybody in here in this party thinks you're annoying.

Then when I walk in, the spouse doesn't come to, sorry, the host doesn't come and greet me. And I think, well, that's because they think I'm annoying and the minute I walk in, I look over and there's a couple that had, that was laughing in the corner and I'm thinking, Oh, they saw me outside. They're talking about, they're talking about me.

Right. You see, my cognitive bias now determines everything that I see and it filters your, your lens and it changes your worldview. Then you leave the party and your friend comes with you and says, Oh, by the way, you didn't believe what I said about everybody thinks you're annoying. Right? Like you didn't really believe that, did you?

And you're like, oh my gosh, yeah I did. And it was the worst party I've ever been to. All because you were believing a lie. So, yeah, your spouse does have goodwill towards you, even if your spouse said something that they shouldn't have said, or even if they didn't, you know, remember to get you that thing that you wanted them to get and all that kind of stuff.

You know, people get busy. Right. You don't know what it's like to be in someone else's mind, especially a guy. Uh, does, has no clue what it's like to be in a woman's mind in terms of when she's a, a wife and a mom, she doesn't just think for herself. So we have a family of six. Tori thinks for six people.

Like, I think for one, you know what I'm saying? Just because she's, oh yeah, sometimes I don't even think about it. For myself, I do think about that. You know, the dudes that can't pack for themselves when they're going on a trip. It's like, my wife's got to pack for me. He's like, Oh, you serious? Very thankful that you can pack.

So, but she's thinking about the kids all the time. And so sometimes that means that yes, she's going to miss some things. That's the way it's going to work. Just give her some space, give her the benefit of the doubt, and make sure that your cognitive bias for your spouse is always in the positive. Okay?

Now, that being said, um, that's all about love and respect, and Tori and I now want to talk about the three cycles that, that uh, Emerson talks about. He, he gives us the energy cycle, the draining cycle, and the reward cycle. Tori and I have redefined these. Um, as we do a marriage seminar on this and I give Emerson full credit, but we call it the us cycle, the me cycle and the God cycle.

So let's talk about these three cycles. First, the us cycle. This is what Emerson calls the energy cycle. This is where both spouses are meeting their spouses need. Right. So when she feels loved, she responds with respect. When he feels respected, he responds with love. And the man has given the wife what she needs.

She's feeling prioritized and loved. And the husband now is getting what he needs. He's feeling respected and admired. And it's just this energize, energizing cycle, right? Your love tank is completely full. Yeah. All right. That's what Tori and I call the us cycle. We have a little phrase. We want to be in us.

That's where everything is going good. Okay. Then the me cycle, Emerson calls it the draining cycle. This is where neither one are meeting the other's needs. So when she feels unloved, cause she's not feeling prioritized, then she reacts with disrespect. She's not going to thank him for anything. She's not going to praise him for anything.

Why would she do that when she doesn't feel like she's the priority? Therefore he responds with. Without making her feel prioritized, right? And he doesn't respond with the love that she needs. Why would I prioritize her when she just nags me all the time, right? And so, neither one are meeting the needs of the other.

This is the draining cycle. Both are feeling drained by each other. This is when your love tank is completely empty. So those are the two different cycles. Now, there's a third cycle, okay? Well, before we get to this third cycle... Which is the God cycle. We'll talk about that in a second. Emerson calls it the reward cycle.

There's a problem. We typically withhold what our spouse needs in order to get what we need. Wow. When Emerson wrote that, I was like, wow, that, that to me, it was the most powerful thought in the book that she's not giving me. The respect that I need, I'm not going to give her the love she needs. But that is the opposite direction.

You're supposed to go, especially for a guy who's called to love his wife as Christ loved the church. But that is a major issue is that you think in order to get what I want, I'm going to withhold what she needs. In order to get what I need, I'm going to withhold what she needs, or in order to get what I want, I'm going to withhold what he wants.

You can't do that. That's where we find ourselves getting into the God cycle. Okay, the God cycle is what Emerson calls the reward cycle. So remember, the first cycle, neither or both spouses are meeting each other's needs, and it's great, and you're feeling energy. The other cycle is the me cycle. That's the draining cycle where neither one are meeting each other's needs.

Now in the God cycle, the reward cycle, this is where only one person is meeting the needs of the other. Okay. Um, this is where one person decides, okay, I'm not getting my needs met. However, I'm going to choose to meet the need of my spouse unconditionally, knowing that God will reward me for it. That's why Emerson calls it the reward cycle.

Either way you're rewarded. Yeah. You're looking for the reward from God. Yeah. That's so good. In this cycle, we're meeting our spouse's needs as unto the Lord, which 23. Wow. That's love as unto the Lord. Matthew 25, 40, whatever you've done to the least of these, you've done it unto me. When your spouse is not giving you.

The love or respect that you need, they have become the least of these, whatever you've done to the least of these, you've done it to me. So God is saying, love your spouse or, you know, love your wife or respect your husband and do it as unto me. Even though your husband might not be given you. The love you need, or even though your wife might not be giving you the respect you need, give them what they need as unto me.

And then Matthew 5 46 tells us if you love others, when they love you, what reward will you get? So if you're giving your spouse what they need, even though they're not giving you what you need, God says, I will reward you. So good. Isn't that good. That's a great promise to hold on to. Yeah. So to me. You know, typically Tori and I are in the God cycle where I'm meeting her needs.

She's not meeting mine No, but listen when you do that God says that he rewards you and I'm telling you one of the ways he rewards you is he starts to he'll get the attention Of your spouse. Yeah, it's so true. Watch what happens. Yeah Another thing that that he mentions and it just right off the jump is that science research confirms this love and respect as being a foundation for success in marriage and I think this is the first time we are introduced to Dr.

John Gottman was in this was right at the beginning of this book, Love and Respect, because he talks about a study that was done. I'm just going to read this real quick to you guys. Um, Dr. John Gottman in, uh, Love and Respect. A professor in the Department of Psychology led a research team that spent 20 years studying 2, 000 couples who had been married 20 to 40 years to the same partner.

These people came from diverse backgrounds and, but one thing was similar, the tone of their conversations. As these couples talk together, almost always there was what Gottman calls a strong undercurrent of two basic ingredients, love and respect. These are the direct opposite. Of the antidote for contempt, perhaps the most corrosive force in marriage.

So I just thought that was so interesting. You know, we talk a lot about Dr. John Gottman, who's a research, um, psychologist and he just studies couples for years and years and years. And this was something that he saw in those couples that when there was an undercurrent of love and respect, um, contempt was avoided, which is the top killer in marriage contempt.

Yeah. Contempt is unchecked criticism in your mind. For your spouse, when you're constantly focusing on the negative in your spouse. And then you bring in the element of comparison where you believe that you are better than your spouse because you don't think that you, you, you in your mind, don't feel as though you're as bad as they are.

So contempt is a killer. And we've talked about contempt a lot on our podcast. You need to go back and listen to the four horsemen. We talked about the killers of relationship, but what we see here is that when husbands make their wives feel the priority, she receives it as love. When wives make their husbands feel admired through thanks and praise, then he receives it as respect.

And when both spouses are meeting these needs for love and respect, you are in full energy mode. That is a great cycle to be in. But if one or both are not meeting the needs, then the other should choose to do it, knowing that you'll be rewarded by God. Yeah, so good. And that is a great place to be, because you need to remember, marriage, your marriage is not ultimately about you and your spouse, it's about you and Jesus.

Marriage is the opportunity to live in love like Him. So, that's why we can grow, we can grow close to God through our marriages and then our marriages will ultimately reflect Him. So good. I feel like we just kind of scratched the surface of this. We could probably go a whole lot deeper in another podcast, but we got to close this one up and I'm going to share a recipe, um, with you guys.

I had my daughter called me last week or maybe it was a couple of weeks ago and she's like, Can you send me your chicken pot pie recipe? I just love that Allie is asking these questions now at 19. I know. But it was, chicken pot pie was like a staple when the kids were growing up and I started off with a very unhealthy recipe.

It was like canned cream of chicken and cream of mushroom. Oh, it was a lot of sodium. It was a lot of sodium and somebody had made me this recipe when I think Allie was born actually. Anyways. Anyways. So. You know, as we got healthier, I started making a little bit healthier recipes, and I was trying to find my recipe, couldn't find it, and I came across this one that was very similar to the, to the one that I had been making, and so, um, and, you know, the, everything is written out, so I'm going to share that with you.

It's by Amber's Kitchen, um, Amber, amberskitchencooks. com is where it comes from, but I follow her on Instagram, and she, um, she's very much into sourdough, and she has some really good healthy recipes. And so it's called easy chicken pot pie, um, by amberskitchencooks. com. And it turned out very good. And it was actually pretty, pretty easy to make.

And I'm going to tell you guys, um, what I think is the star of the show in this recipe. It's not in her, it's not in her, um, in her recipe, but if you guys can get your hands on some poultry seasoning, it's the same one I used. Um, I'm going to use this chicken for last week's recipe with the chicken alfredo.

Jason, didn't you love that chicken? Oh my gosh. It was like this is the best chicken. This this spice is so good. It's by Frontier Co op non GMO. Um poultry seasoning. I think I got it at Earth Fair. You get it like Whole Foods probably on Amazon and it's uh poultry seasoning with sage thyme and onion and it just makes chicken taste so good.

So I use this. Um, and I've used it as a spice in the chicken pot pie and I've it just made it even better. I feel like and then um the other thing to make it a little bit easier is she she calls like you chop. It's a lot of chopping but you can just grab a veggie blend a frozen veggie blend. That's what I did.

I just grabbed in the frozen aisle carrots, green beans, peas, and corn. I think that's the mix that it comes in and you just steam that and then you're not chopping a gazillion vegetables and it. It tastes really good. And then I always add extra peas. I love peas, a lot of peas in a chicken pot pie. So I didn't, I went heavy on the peas and then, um, got that blend, made it a lot easier and I just used, uh, the refrigerated double, uh, double pie crust they come into in the refrigerated section of your grocer.

Um, and that makes it a lot easier to anyways, it's, it is comfort food at its finest. And this is the time of year where you should be eating a lot of comfort food. Yeah, you should. You got, you're working on your before picture. Yeah, exactly. So that by the time spring comes around, you'll have your after picture.

Um, so anyway, well, thanks for hanging out with us. This was fun. Um, Tori and I love whenever we, uh, get an opportunity to kind of give you the cliff notes on books and podcasts and, um, articles that we read that really help in relationship. So this one is at the top of the list, love and respect Dr.

Emerson and Sarah Egeritz. And um, so thanks for hanging with us and we'll see you next week. Bye guys. Peace.